Will Quartz ever be released?

A release date? a guess? hello? is anyone home?

[Cyberzero]

Yea what is the deal?

[srigby]

Does it matter anymore?

Anyone familiar with the Coke vs Pepsi wars?

I've been a loyal SnapStream user and beta tester since October last year, and a heavy forum user as my Post's count will attest to.

But I've seen no progress out of SnapStream for a long time. So, my eyes started to wander in search of something that offered quality and stability.

I came across ShowShifter about 6 months ago, and at that stage, there was no competition. SnapStream was/seemed to be a far superior product....but the people at ShowShifter havn't been asleep at the wheel. They've just released their Release Candidate v1 of ShowShifter v1.7 - a massive leap forward to what it used to be.

Their beta programme is open to anyone who's interested....and I've been pleased to see how they've been delivering on features that SnapStream are still only promising.

So, I pose the question: Does it really matter anymore?

[ June 06, 2002, 02:16 AM: Message edited by: srigby ]

well, my biggest problem is the revelation that snapstream won't do 640x480 capture with de-interlacing.. it flat out doesn't work on any computer I can find. This is a major feature for me and all the other programs like windows media encoder and powervcr can do it on my machines without any issues. I've got an 80 inch projection screen and viewing 320x240 max res when I've got tons of cpu power to spare is really harsh.

ok I just took a look at showshifter. One of the major reasons that I've stuck with snapstream so long is that it's all based around a fully networkable interface. I can hit it from anywhere on the internet and watch my shows at work/parent's house/friend's house as if it were local. From what I've seen of showshifter, it's really meant for the local person controlling everything from that local machine with some makeshift web-based program entering thrown in. There's people complaining on their forums that it doesn't work well. Not having high res capture is really the suck, but not having a networked environment would be a total showstopper for me. (mild pun intended). If you're just doing local tv watching like that, just go with a Tivo; beats the pants off all this stuff and works flawlessly.

[thor]

Festivalman, I have a 70 inch Mitubishi tv (about 8 years old) and am hooked up to SS via my 1.6 gig Dell CPU, with Windows Xp through a Leadtek 2000 XP tuner card. I export by using TVtool. I am trying to optimize my settings to the TV. Any suggestions would be incredibly helpful. I am using VHS quality and really don't like the picture. What quality settings do you use in SS? TV Tool suggest your can bring your resolution up to 720 x 480 by adding three lines of programing to the NVidia video card in my CPU. I haven't tried it yet and maybe self-limited by the the resolutoin on the Mitsubishi TV, not sure. Should I send a de-interlaced signal? TV Tool has a box to do this.

Thanks,

Thor

[srigby]

Festivalman:

You've hit the nail right on the head. That is the biggest difference and IMHO the area where ShowShifter lacks functionality most of all. This was partly by designed, because the product was designed to work the way you described.

But there was a change of direction about 2-3 months ago and that is evident in the product. The web interface to ShowShifter is a third party product - and I'm really on their case to move it forward.

But, de-interlacing? Works brilliantly on ShowShifter. You don't need a super fast machine either. Re-compression is another way to get GREAT quality/compression out of an average machine (CPU wise).

Plus you can use multiple codecs and output in multiple formats. This is where ShowShifter is light years ahead of SnapStream.

[Magellan]

srigby, I tried showshifter in March, and it was garbage then. Is there a new version out? Does it still look like some gradeschool project? The version I tried had the same capture options and quality as Snapstream, and since it had no ability to stream over the network, I saw no value to it. The timeshifting wasn't as polished as my ATI software, and it kept crashing. Also, the problems you guys are talking about are not a problem on a 27" tv. I have no quality problems at full screen. Is it because of the large screen size (80")?

[PBMax]

Quartz is still scheduled to be released at the End of June. As the date gets closer we will know if that date is a reality.

As for Showshifter it is more suited for timeshifting. It's slow and I think the ATI software is better if you want this capability. It does include some other features that Snapstream doesn't (DVD player, Music Player) but you can get these capabilites from other Free products (www.media-box.org). It's all about what you want. Snapstream will release quartz when it is ready to be released. Trying to get Snapstream to rush it's next version out the door isn't going to get a quality product. The last release before this beta for Showshifter was at the end of last year so they are developing about at the same rate as Snapstream. The only difference is that Snapstream promotes their product well and people are anticipating the next version. Showshifter keeps it under wraps until it is time to release it.

[srigby]

Magellan:

There have been numerous new versions since March, and only recently has it become solid enough to rely on. What impresses me is how they've been able to fix the problems that SnapStream couldn't.

* Putting your system into StandBy if you've got an ATI card with a RageTheatre chipset (even ATI havn't fixed this in their own MMC software!)

* Freedom to use multiple codecs and output in multiple formats

* Support for re-compression. Allows for top quality and max compression on mid-spec PCs. Also the only real option if you want to end up with a DivX format.

You're right about the streaming side of things, but this is being built by a third party. (Maybe this way they are protected from lawsuits by the TV networks???)

If you havn't tried v1.7 RC1 - then you havn't tried ShowShifter.

Well I got tired of clunky interfaces and products that never arrived... I did go the route of TiVo just a few weeks ago when Quartz was NOT released. I have been thoroughly impressed and pleased. Granted I'm not exporting anything or playing across the network, but the device works flawless with what it does and the interface is beautiful. And it's available (used for $100).

I also use an LCD projector to power my home theater and need higher resolutions, working de-interlace, etc. I pipe TiVo through Dscaler 4.0 and all is well.

It would be nice to have soft copies of the shows to take on my laptop, but I'd rather sacrafice portability for ease of use and better picture quality.

[srigby]

And if it's not bad enough that SnapStream has been overtaken in the PVS stakes...what comes out a month after Quartz.....

...FreeStyle.

So, if you want to make the MS path, go for it.

Good to know that you have an alternative, though...

[jmracek]

Are you sure that snapstream isn't getting in
bed with microsoft somehow and the Quartz and
FreeStyle might end up being the same thing.
Bill Gates did enjoy showing off snapstream
last year.
??????

Yeah, I use a Tivo in parallel with snapstream. My digital cable box locks up about once a month and I lose shows, so I use have SS do the same shows so I won't miss any if this happens. I'd ditch the Tivo in a minute if we could get de-interlacing going at 640x480. Right now snapstream doesn't work with de-interlacing (even though the option is there), but the snapstream guys say they're going to try and get it going for Quartz. On my 80 inch projected screen, 320x240 looks really @#$#!'ing harsh. To answer the guy's question from above, I use 320x240 wm8 at 200kbits/second for normal viewing. I'll go to full res when snapstream can handle it. For good encodes off my Tivo, I use windows media encoder 7.1 with windows media codec 8, at 640x480 at 150k/second with de-interlacing. Looks amazing. I was under the impression that snapstream used the windows media encoding engine to do it's thing... but the fact that windows media encoder can do full res de-interlaced, and snapstream can't, kind of dispells that theory.

I know everyone's anti-microsoft and all that, but the idea of snapstream becoming a Freestyle implementation would rock. Although I support guys who write their own apps from the ground up, there's nothing like a tried and tested interface with good artwork that has its core written by the same guys that did the operating system. I know we all want open stuff, but look how great games for the consoles look vs the stuff for the PC... when all the components are predictable and there's a given set of rules, some awesome home theater controlling software will result.