HDTV Monitors

[TV Scheduler]

I know that many others, like myself, have bought things because people have reviewed and commented on that product. Then after we get our hands on that product, it appears that the review was nothing more than a paid commentary.

Over the last few years I have been spending a lot of time and money on a system for recording and playing back TV. I've learned a lot of things and written a lot of code. I'm considering converting TVScheduler.net into a place where I can express my opinions on the hardware and software I've used.

Right now I would like to talk about HDTV display devices because it doesn't matter what all your other toys can do if you don't have the right TV.

I own a Panasonic Multimedia Projection Display, model PT-43LC14. It's a 42" rear projection LCD TV. It claims to take a RGB input at 1280X720. But this isn't the case. The display is over-scanned at that resolution. 1200X668 is as close as I can come to the correct size.

I discovered that I like sitting in a nice chair with the keyboard in my lap and I completely stopped using the other computer with a 19" monitor. I now do all my computer work on the TV.

I also changed the way I used the PVR software that I had written for a TV. It's now a mix of keyboard, mouse and remote.

It's my feeling that I had to pay way too much for this unit because it has features I don't need. What I would like to see is a rear projection LCD computer monitor without all the TV stuff.

The bottom line is that I would buy this TV again but only because I can't find the monitor I want.

Anyone else?

Bob

[DanielS]

Well, Bob I know a lot about researching things BEFORE you buy because I have done too precious little far too many times in the past, buying on impulse instead. Not so with my recent HDTV purchase. I figured I had one chance to get it right. I don't ever plan on plunking that much money down on a Television/Monitor again before checking out models in the afterlife.

My criteria were these:

• It had to be large because both my wife and I are legally blind (20/200). So the biggest we could afford that did NOT sacrifice quality was called for.

• It had to have a stunning picture; but note what legally blind people consider stunning others may find less so.

• No burn in, so that left DLP or LCD.

• Since I needed to advise my customers on HTPC hookups, it needed to have every possible connection immaginable.

After finding a model I thought would fill the bill, I camped out on AVS Forums for the better part of a day and a night and doted over every word of 75+ pages of reviews and comments.

What I found more than confirmed my choice. No, my prized Samsung 61" HLP6163W DLP is not perfect, but damn close in my eyes (punn not intended). The AVS Forum posters, most of them professional ISF calibrators, DO think the picture is stunning. But what I get off on are the DVI, HDMI, Component, S-Video, etc, etc, etc, inputs for HTPC usage. Yes, I love the picture too.

Like you, I have taken to using it as my main computer monitor, that is, when I can pry it away from BTV's commercial-free movies and TV!

[TV Scheduler]

Daniel, I guess you'll have an intuitive understanding of my next subject about HDTV recording quality.

You didn't say if it had a RGB input, or if it were correctly sized.

I haven't tried the HDMI input. I refused to pay what they wanted for a few wires machine connected to a plug.

I did try ATI's DVI to component adapter. The TV still overscanned the image. It may just need a minor internal adjustment.

I am glad to hear that I'm not alone in my thinking that PVRs will need a major interface change in the near future. When you get these big monitors, you just don't use the TV or Computer in the same way anymore. A TV program is playing in the upper right hand corner of my screen while I type this message. When I'm done I'll just pop it back to full screen and skip back to where I left off.

Bob

[DanielS]

Bob, yes absolutely has an RGB input, though I've been far to busy to get to that yet. According to the forum users, if I feed it a 720p signal and select the EXPAND option on the remote, it should size correctly within nearly 1% overscan. That I should be able to adjust with my upcoming Nvidia drivers.

You are absolutely right that this indeed does change things. That's why I got into this business. I think HTPCs are more than just PVRs (*) or at least they "can" be with the right software and tender-loving tuning. When I switched from S-Video to Component, I was amazed at the text I could read. Imagine what I could be able to do with DVI or RGB!!

(*) This is a footnote to Rich A. here. Rich's well-supported view (if I may try to paraphrase here) is that the HTPC is solely a PVR whose role is to support the Theater Room and as such should run stably 24/7. Basically we agree completely accept for the word solely. I believe it should be always on, optimized and as stable as one can make it. But I differ in that I build HTPCs for people who want to use them for a multiplicity of uses besides timeshifting TV and driving a Theater, e.g. HI-Def Web, Email, Office Apps, Chat, Gaming, Home Control, etc. They want to pay one price and get one machine. A challenge, yes to be sure. Is the hardware up to it? Yes it is. Is Beyond TV? That is the Horse I have chosen to back. I hope I am not wrong.

[ggayowsky]

Interesting thread on a couple of counts. I bought a Panasonic CT-34WX54 HDTV monitor last year. At the time the cost/benefit was fine but it lacks 720p support and overscan is a minor anoyance. Direct view 480p/1080i is good enough for my eyes, it is viewable in my sunlit family room and I was able to pay cash. Figuring out which monitor is "the" best and which one is appropriate for your personal circumstances are two different optimizations.

This year I decided to build a PC based entertainment system around it. I felt the technology, including BTV, was mature enough for a stable solution.
I followed your link to check out your systems and was surprised to see a very similar PC system to the one I built. There is not a component in any of your systems that I did not research. Your guiding philosophy hits the right notes.

The DVI-HDMI cable was worth the exepense to me. Don't go cheap over the last 36". The prices vary wildly but I found a good one for $45. It did not fix over-scan. I used PowerStrip to make most of the adjustments.

I am an electronics engineer by day and, based on my experience, your recommendations and systems are credible.

[DanielS]

Originally Posted by ggayowsky

... Your guiding philosophy hits the right notes. ... I am an electronics engineer by day and, based on my experience, your recommendations and systems are credible.

ggayowsky, thanks so much for the kind words of encouragement. Like most of the folks on this board, I have put a great deal of time, experimentation and thought into the design of my HTPCs. It is also a great compliment since in college I wanted to become an Electronics Engineer, but decided the time and discipline required of me for such a rigorous program would be too much; so I switched to something easy. In my case it was Computer Science. Thanks again.

[Rich A]

Originally Posted by DanielS

Bob, yes absolutely has an RGB input, though I've been far to busy to get to that yet.

(snip)

(*) This is a footnote to Rich A. here. Rich's well-supported view (if I may try to paraphrase here) is that the HTPC is solely a PVR whose role is to support the Theater Room and as such should run stably 24/7. Basically we agree completely accept for the word solely. I believe it should be always on, optimized and as stable as one can make it. But I differ in that I build HTPCs for people who want to use them for a multiplicity of uses besides timeshifting TV and driving a Theater, e.g. HI-Def Web, Email, Office Apps, Chat, Gaming, Home Control, etc. They want to pay one price and get one machine. A challenge, yes to be sure. Is the hardware up to it? Yes it is. Is Beyond TV? That is the Horse I have chosen to back. I hope I am not wrong.

See my reply to the "footnote" in another thread. Continuing discussion on HT vs MM

[TV Scheduler]

Originally Posted by Rich A

Oh boy !! I got a footnote !!

Please check the subject line. If you want to debate toys for the wealthy that's fine but start a new thread.

Bob

[ggayowsky]

Sorry if I started a tangent. My point was that choosing a monitor should reflect the applications and environment of the owner. People select monitors to fit their lifestyle which may or may not include outrageous wealth. Lifestyle is as valid a selection criteria as pixel specifications. Ever notice how there is always a market for "the most expensive" which may have nothing to do with the technical specifications?

Personally, I separate "entertainment" and work. I have a laptop for work. Who needs 52" of fixed location email? My HTPC has games, FM and internet radio, music, DVD, TV, web access...but not Microsoft Office. I refuse to load an e-mail package and do not believe in instant messaging. This simplification actually makes over-scanning less of an issue.

[Rich A]

Originally Posted by TV Scheduler

Please check the subject line. If you want to debate toys for the wealthy that's fine but start a new thread.

Bob

And here I ACTUALLY posted in other areas warnings about hijacking threads. Tsk tsk. Shame on me. I corrected my reply accordingly. Mea Culpa ...

How's my new reply look? Hey Dan .. you made me do it. How did you get a pass on the off-topic note ?? (just kidding guys) ...

[DanielS]

Originally Posted by ggayowsky

Sorry if I started a tangent. My point was that choosing a monitor should reflect the applications and environment of the owner. ...

Actually G. you do not need to apologize. That particular point is what Bob and I were discussing. How large screen hi-def clarity changes things in terms of convergence of the PC app and the TV app.

The confusion is actually my fault as a result of two things:

1. footnoting Rich (though somewhat still on topic)
2. Updating my Sig. which I haven't done in over a year.

So, at least your monitor comment was fine. Your words about my systems, though appreciated and encouraging would, in hind sight, have been better sent in a Private Message.

Keep posting, we need people like you here. Your experiences can be invaluable to us all.