Need suggestions to upgrade server

[NickHark]

I think I need to replace my BTV server.

I see a big spike is the processor usage when two or more recordings are being completed, which suggests to me that when the CPU is overstressed it cannot process the naming cleanup processes properly. This is what I believe has caused the intermittent failures of recordings. Also, when two HD-PVR recordings are going, I push the CPU to its limit when I watch anything on Link through that server. That's why I normally watch all my recordings through another BTV server on Link.

For example, yesterday I was recording two HD-PVR recordings that ended at the same time. As the two programs were completing their tasks, one if the recordings caused BTV to throw off the "hang":

Error Code: 41
7/2/2012 8:03:09 AM
Beyond TV detected a hang in "HD-PVR2" and could not terminate the process hosting the device when attempting to recover. This is a serious error that is usually caused by malfunctioning hardware or improperly written drivers.

I was able to save the five hour Tour de France stage by changing the hidden attributes on the file to "not hidden" so when I rebooted the server the file was not deleted automatically by BTV.

I can actually watch this hang happen when the bling lights on one of the HD-PVRs stops and starts.....

So, I think I need to get another server to help eliminate this "baby-sitting" aspect of BTV. Note that I can record six programs with the combination of 3 HD-PVRs and the 4 QAM tuners on HDHR, its just the back end processing that seems to send it over the cliff.

What new or used PC model will give me the added horsepower needed that will support XP and is not overkill?

[tscales]

Hmm. The XPS410 is pretty powerful. They're the basis of most of my servers. I do have a couple XPS420, but they're not really any more powerful.

[NickHark]

Originally Posted by tscales

Hmm. The XPS410 is pretty powerful. They're the basis of most of my servers. I do have a couple XPS420, but they're not really any more powerful.

Tom,

I got mine because of your good luck with yours...

I am taxing the dual core pretty much.

I really cannot watch a recorded or recording program on that PC if I am recording 2 or more programs. It seems to always produce the dreaded "hang."

Have you noticed the spike when a recording completes. I must note that I do not do any post processing except the normal "SnapStream File Tagger" procedure.

[Bill1426]

My System (look below at info), has been doing well.. It runs BTV (records 4 channels, & post processes), FTP Server, Boinc (computing Seti@home jobs), Downloads TV shows with uTorrent (automatically), and runs PcAnywhere host (for my remote connections)..
And I watch the Shows with BTV on the same system.

[optikhog]

Nick, do you see this problem when not using the HD-PVR's? I'm using a lowly Core 2 Duo for my BTV work with 6 tuners and I do not see anything which comes close to taxing my system, so I'm wondering if this might be something specific to the HD-PVR usage...

[NickHark]

Originally Posted by Bill1426

My System (look below at info), has been doing well.. It runs BTV (records 4 channels, & post processes), FTP Server, Boinc (computing Seti@home jobs), Downloads TV shows with uTorrent (automatically), and runs PcAnywhere host (for my remote connections)..
And I watch the Shows with BTV on the same system.

Bill I think there is a big difference between PC using 2250s and 1600s and systems that use HD-PVR. I've used multiples of these cards with nothing like the hang problems I have with the HD-PVRs.

My system runs beautifully when I don't have multiple starts and stops with 2 or more of the HD-PVRs.

For example; One day his last week I recorded on the HD-PVRs a multi-hour HBO series, the Tour de France and a golf tournament. Plus a few recordings thrown in on the QAM HDHR tuners. We are talking 30-50g of recordings. I got the "hang" and had to change the attribute from hidden on an 18g Tour de France file to save it when the HD-PVR recording ended.

There must be something about the processing of the HD-PVR start-stops in the USB part of the processor and/or motherboard that is so demanding. As I have said, I can recording with all eight tuners and the CPU doesn't get over 60%, but throw in watching on Link when one of the HD-PVRs stops and I'll get a hang, or stop two or more HD-PVR recordings at the same time, while watching on Link I'll get the "hang."

I used to use my Intel quad core PC for my recording server but I unknowingly ran into this problem with it and got the DELL to use as a dedicated BTV server. In other words I don't do a thing on this DELL PC except run BTV server with all 8 tuners.

I reboot the PC every night. I cycle the HD-PVRs with a DLI web switch each night. I run a registry scan every day to eliminate errors in the registry, which do crop up. I defrag once per week. I record the files locally and then run xxcopy batch files to move the recordings to a NAS late at night. The firewall is off.

It seems like if I had a little more "USB power?" this problem would go away.

[NickHark]

Interestingly, I tried to web admin from another PC to the Dell at the same time as the Tour de France was finishing, I watched the Task Manager CPU usage spike to nearly 100%, I noted that the BTV network service was running at 35% of my CPU and I then immediately got the "41 hang."

It was the only HD-PVR recording or process going on.

(I changed the attributes to not hidden and saved the 19g TDF file.)

The Dell hung for 5 minutes at "Windows is shutting down" when I tried rebooting the PC, and then successfully rebooted after I cycled the offending HD-PVR.

After reboot my Performance meter in Task manager is 70-80% usage wwith the system using 40%, BTVNetwork service is 30+-% and the system idle process is 30%, its bouncing around...

[Bill1426]

In your CMOS (BIOS), is the USB setup for Hi-Speed or Full Speed ??
Hi-Speed = 480Mb/s
Full Speed = 12 Mb/s

[Jakesty]

I have a quad core server and run as many processes as it can handle concurrently. Always maxing out the 4 processors, all of the time. In addition I run folding at home too just to max the hell out of it. I also don't defrag, never clean the registry and try to never reboot except if I need to patch the OS. I don't get dropped recordings, and now I've got a PRIME unit with two tuners in addition to the possible 4 HDHR digital tuners. I run all post processing immediately.

It really does sound like you're pushing too much through your USB. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the speeds that BILL1426 quoted is for the entire USB chipset, not per port. So it could just be too much.

It also could be a hard drive thing (but I doubt it) since I know those HD-PVR's record a lot of data. I'm not sure of what kind of arrays you might have but you could try balancing where some of those recordings go so there is more SATA throughput too.

You also know better than I about how finicky those units can be so you might just chaulk it up to that.

Remember as a job is recording there is very little CPU overhead, it should just be dumping to the HD, unless you have a Software RAID 5 or something and it's computing the parity, but even that should not be enough to drop your system.
On some systems they have two areas which separate USB, so you might try a different grouping of ports on your system. I'm not sure how to tell you how they are separate except if you had USB 3.0. You also could install a cheap $20 USB 3.0 card and put some of your tuners there and that should give you some bandwidth breathing room. I tend to think this is where your problem is.

Now don't get me wrong, I love the quad core, you have so many potential concurrent recordings it would probably do you well to get at least 4 if not 8 hyperthreaded cores. I'd be looking at the 1155 chipset with a 2600k CPU. The prices are very good and you're getting a pretty fast server unless you bump up to the next level with a 2011 chipset and something like a 3820 CPU.

[NickHark]

Originally Posted by Jakesty

I have a quad core server and run as many processes as it can handle concurrently.

I have run 2x 2250s and 2x 1600s with an additional 500 and have had good success recording many more recordings per day than I do now. It is the stopping of the HD-PVRs that throws off the error "41" (the inability to complete the stopping of the recording.

I checked my bios and there are no settings to change the USB IO speed.

I just recalled that I upgraded the HD-PVR drivers to 1.7.30059.1 so I will roll back to the drivers I had before and see what happens. Perhaps Hauppauge is writing drivers to more track Win7 and not XP...

By the way, I got an error "41" this morning on the Tour de France after five hours of recording. and that HD-PVR was the only thing running. Yesterday I went thru the running services and turned more stuff off, just in case.

Update: Rolled back to hdpvr_1.6.29353

Right now I am recording 3 HD-PVR recordings and the processor performance is 4-10%

[tscales]

The problem is the HD PVR themselves. They just kinda suck. They're wildly unreliable. So much so that I have a set time every day where I power OFF both the HD PVR and the Server and restart it. Still not reliable.

It isn't the speed of your machine. I run a single HD PVR on a Q6600 Quad Core. Still locks a lot.

[Zogg]

Agreed, I like having a quad core cpu for post processing, streaming, etc. but that's not your problem - it's the HDPVR itself. They are just finicky devices.

Make sure you have a good power supply for it - oversized ones are better as they seem to be more stable, as per the HDPVR thread.

[NickHark]

Originally Posted by Zogg

Agreed, I like having a quad core cpu for post processing, streaming, etc. but that's not your problem - it's the HDPVR itself. They are just finicky devices.

Make sure you have a good power supply for it - oversized ones are better as they seem to be more stable, as per the HDPVR thread.

They do suck, but I rolled back to hdpvr_1.6.29353
and have gotten through several recordings over the weekend and thru till Tuesday late afternoon and I haven't had a "41" error or any other error. Several times all three HD-PVRs were recording. I am happy. I don't know what possessed me to upgrade to the latest drivers. Its fairly obvious that they are writing to Win7 and not XP.

By the way, I have utlized 5 amp power supplies for all three.

I might point out for those lurking, that I ran the HWclear to remove all references to Hauppauge on my system and then ran the driver installation executable. This while liberally rebooting.