Why QAM is important

[Rich A]

I think the next "big thing" that we should be worried about is QAM capability. Why? Read on.

The entire media world is quickly turning to digital format. In fact in the very near future ALL terrestrial TV stations still running analog TV now, will be converted to digital only. This is the FCC mandate. It IS coming. When that happens, those of us who are watching our local over-the-air analog TV broadcasts are going to be forced to either buy a set top digital tuner for our old analog TVs or replace our TVs with a newer digital tuner model.

In fact the FCC has been slowly integrating digital TVs into the market. All TVs made or sold in the US will have to have digital tuners in them by a certain date. They are phasing this in by screen size. Up to so many inches must be digital by xxx date. Up to the next size by yyy date and so on until after a couple years you won't be able to buy any TV of any size without a digital tuner.

And as I said, for OTA reception you are going to NEED it. All analog TVs will by then be converted to 100 percent digital.

Okay .. so those of us with our current OTA Digital tuners in our PC-based TVs are already covered. Hooray for us. I currently have two OTA digital tuners and just love the clarity of the OTA digital signals I can receive. Not to mention the outstanding (up to 1080) HD formats. BUT what about the guys with analog PC-based tuners? I also have two of those and enjoy my analog CABLE TV stations.

Well the handwriting is on the wall. As you may or may not know, the FCC controls both the OTA service and the Cable service. They require that any cable system supply the local stations in their basic packages. So everything you can get OTA should also be available on your basic cable service. But have you noticed the increase in DIGITAL cable service? All those local analog stations are available in most cable systems' basic service. And it's available in DIGITAL as well as analog in most cable system. And the digital content provided by the cable companies is using the QAM format. So to receive those you need a QAM capable digital tuner.

So what's the big deal? Where here is where I'm reading between the lines. I believe that soon after all the terrestrial OTA analog stations are GONE, the Cable companies will drop all THEIR analog service. First they will look at the economic implications. They now can rent those of us with analog only TVs a digital converter box/tuner. More $$ for them. Of course if you have a newer TV with a QAM capable digital tuner .. then you are all set. Most of the non-premium analog stations are already available in digital format at no extra cost. Remember the FCC requires the cable companies to provide your local channels to you in your basic service. But more important to the cable companies (IMHO) is the fact that they can squeeze a lot more digital channels into the same bandwidth that analog takes up.

So what's going to happen? I think those of us currently using analog only tuners directly hooked into our cable systems to drive our PVRs are going to be left with only TWO options.
Rent a converter / tuner from the cable company to feed EACH of our analog tuners' S-Video or Composite inputs .. making the analog tuner portion useless. (no analog OTA or on cable)
Or replace our old analog tuners with PC-Based QAM capable tuners.

If Snapstream doesn't keep on top of this QAM thing, we may end up with BTV ONLY working with OTA digital tuners and set top cable boxes ... This may not happen tomorrow, but trust me ... the day will come when the cable TV industry scraps all analog for digital only. There ARE cable QAM capable PC based tuners out there now. The PVR company that jumps on QAM recording is going to have an advantage when all the analog goes the way of the Dodo bird. If we don't have QAM cable support in our PVR software, then when that day comes all of us using analog PC tuners (ie Hauappauge PVR-x50s et al) are going to have a useless PVR.

Of course I realize that currently there ARE a lot of guys currently using cable company converter boxes to feed the analog PVR tuners. This is a warning more to those of you who may have like four analog tuners all being fed directly from your cable. Be prepared to rent 4 cable boxes.
Not to mention that some QAM capable PC-based tuners work like an OTA digital tuner and just records the digital stream directly to the hard drive. No conversion .. so you view the pure digital content in all it's clarity. But if you are feeding those PVR-x50 analog inputs to have them encoded into standard mpeg .. you are going to loose some quality in some cases and a LOT of quality in others. The best those encoders can do is 720x480. With a QAM capable digital tuner, recordings you play back, or live tv you view is going to be in it's original digital format .. up to 1080.

I think the QAM thing is going to be a very important part of PC-based PVRs in the very near future.

I'm Rich A and I approved this post .. (sorry couldn't resist) ...

[cfaslave]

Rich,
I agree with you. Its unfortunate that we in the US will all be forced to deal with the digital thing like it or not, but it is a reality - just a matter of when.

unencrypted QAM is sort of hit-or-miss for many cable users. I for instance can get all of the local channels plus several others that I couldn't get OTA. What I get though will be different than others on other cable networks/cities.

Right now, Fonceur has been diligently working on unofficial QAM support via his plugin. It will allow you to set up recordings ahead of time and record on the HDHomeRun tuner and the FusionHDTV tuner. Its promising, but ideally we need SS to support QAM to make it usable for the masses. I think most of the software PVR companies are waiting to see what VISTA holds for QAM as many tuner manufacturers are waiting to build bda drivers for VISTA and not XP.

[nanook105]

Originally Posted by cfaslave

Rich,
I agree with you. Its unfortunate that we in the US will all be forced to deal with the digital thing like it or not, but it is a reality - just a matter of when.

unencrypted QAM is sort of hit-or-miss for many cable users. I for instance can get all of the local channels plus several others that I couldn't get OTA. What I get though will be different than others on other cable networks/cities.

Right now, Fonceur has been diligently working on unofficial QAM support via his plugin. It will allow you to set up recordings ahead of time and record on the HDHomeRun tuner and the FusionHDTV tuner. Its promising, but ideally we need SS to support QAM to make it usable for the masses. I think most of the software PVR companies are waiting to see what VISTA holds for QAM as many tuner manufacturers are waiting to build bda drivers for VISTA and not XP.

On my first attempt/scan, I did not get any local unencrypted digital channels. I emailed customer support on a Monday afternoon asking why, and by Tuesday evening all of my locals were in the clear. As usual, the cable companies will be playing dumb and stupid on this until we force their hands.

The solutions that Fonceur is working on look promising for the short term (I think that HDHOMERUN is a little further ahead at this point), but I agree with Rich, QAM support needs to be in BTV, and it has to be available for XP

[ClamsTheCat]

I get 23 digital channels via clear QAM. Living in souther California, like 4-5 are in Spanish though. I get all the major networks and the clarity is perfect. No artifacts or weird squares like you get OTA sometimes. My new TV has a tuner built in so I just switch over to that input for HD content. I don't get any TIVO features that way though. Until there is a dummy proof way to do it in BTV or another PVR software that is how it will have to be.

It has to be easy to do via a remote or I will have to cut my head off rather than teach the wife how to set up recordings. I know the progress on the QAM plug-ins with Francour are going well, but that is not a great solution for everyone.

I think that building in support for one card to start (like the DVICO that they sell) should not be that though. I currently rent 3 cable boxes for my BTV and I am ok with that. I will want HD content to record in the future though. In the next 6-12 months either QAM or cablecard will rear its head in Vista or another PVR software. When it does I will have a tough decision to make.

I have checked at 3 friends homes, and all 3 have different cable companies. All 3 also have unencrypted QAM as a part of their basic cable. I most places in the US have QAM available for free with their cable. We need support!

[Eric3a]

When that happens, those of us who are watching our local over-the-air analog TV broadcasts are going to be forced to either buy a set top digital tuner for our old analog TVs or replace our TVs with a newer digital tuner model.

there is another option to keep your old TVs:
I intend to continue to distribute my BTV signal around the house to my SD TVs way after all channels go digital. The only digital part will be my BTV server until HD is real cheap.

Of course you're right that BTV needs QAM support.
Eric

[cat6man]

rich,
i use the HDHomeRun on my cable system which simulcasts all the analog channels and it works great with Fonceur's plug-in....we have a little ways to go but i'm very optimistic, until the cable company turns 5C on...but then we're screwed.

[DonK]

If your local cable company encrypts the local broadcast QAM channels they're in violation of federal law.

I reminded mine of that fact today, I'll keep you guys posted if they relent.

QAM is important.

[jnaranjo]

Originally Posted by cat6man

rich,
i use the HDHomeRun on my cable system which simulcasts all the analog channels and it works great with Fonceur's plug-in....we have a little ways to go but i'm very optimistic, until the cable company turns 5C on...but then we're screwed.

What is 5c and why would we be screwed?

[ClamsTheCat]

Originally Posted by jnaranjo

What is 5c and why would we be screwed?

It's a type of encryption. What he doesn't seem to understand is that the cable companies are not legally allowed to encrypt local channels. They are required to keep them unencrypted with their basic cable package.

Anything that is premium content should be encrypted already, unless he somehow got lucky. I have not heard of anyone getting all digital content in clear QAM accidently yet.

[Fonceur]

Originally Posted by jnaranjo

What is 5c and why would we be screwed?

For firewire, 5c is the protocol/flag that determines how many times you are allowed to copy the content on an autorized device, it can either be copy freely, copy once or never copy. If you are using a D-VHS deck, it is an authorized device, so can make a copy of the first two. But if you use a PC, since it's not an authorized device, you are limited to the copy freely content.

So if they switch on the copy protection on those unencrypted QAM chanels, you probably could not record them...

[jlobello]

I, too, would love to see QAM support in BTV. Once you get past the first hurdle of just being able to make a QAM recording, the next hurdle will be getting channel mapping data. As I recall, there is no guide data source for QAM channels. I think the cable co. can change the QAM mapping at their whim. for bandwidth reasons or what-not, even hour-to-hour. From what I've read, this is what drove Tivo v3 to only support CableCard, if you want guide data. Overall, it seems like a losing proposition for a DVR. What good is a DVR if you can't reliably schedule upcoming recordings, set season passes, etc?

But that said, I'd still love to see basic QAM recording in BTV. I guess a manual channel mapping function would be necessary & you'd have to live with rerunning the channel mapping occasionally.

[Rich A]

The digital channel line up is already there. If your cable TV provider has digital content you can add it to your existing line-ups in BTV.

Here all I did was select add new line-up from the BTV setup wizard. And found "Cox Digital - Non-rebuild". This line up is ALL the digital stations my provider has .. Free QAM as well as all the premium and encrypted digital.

I'm assuming the "Non-rebuild" might mean that it will add the line up as a new and separate line up (so you may have duplicate channel listings?) ie. your old existing analog but with it's Digital counterpart listed separately. I'm thinking if you chose just "Cox Digital" it would it might add the new channels mixed in with your existing all on one guide. ?? Don't know for sure ..

I'll bet someone with a cable company set top tuner can fill us in how it works. Obviously the digital guide information "has" to exist or else how would they use their external cable company tuner with BTV ??

[nanook105]

Originally Posted by jlobello

As I recall, there is no guide data source for QAM channels. I think the cable co. can change the QAM mapping at their whim. for bandwidth reasons or what-not, even hour-to-hour. From what I've read, this is what drove Tivo v3 to only support CableCard, if you want guide data. Overall, it seems like a losing proposition for a DVR. What good is a DVR if you can't reliably schedule upcoming recordings, set season passes, etc?

This is not true for me. My local channels from my HD cable box are the same as the digital channels that I get via QAM. I'd be surprised if the would change that often since the cable company would also have to change their guide.

[FunSavingATon]

The problem that software providers such as Snapstream will encounter with QAM support in the near future is the interest from Cable TV companies being able to reclaim the bandwidth in the downstream part of their HF/C systems. This is being done through a number of mechanisms, including Dynamic Channel Change (DCC) mechanisms that dynamically assign programs to channels. Unfortunately, this only works for receivers that have implemented OCAP -- something only really found in set-top boxes.

While OCAP is not required under the FCC's Plug-and-Play agreement, it is unclear:
1) if an operator is considered in compliance with Plug-and-Play if the Digital channels are also available as Analog channels allowing DCC to be implemented,
2) if an operator is considered in compliance if they make set-top boxes with firewire available to their customers, also allowing DCC to be implemented, or
3) if the Plug-and-Play regulations will be revisited/revised to include OCAP.

Of course, these issues are immaterial outside of the US -- making DCC more likely to be implemented internationally first...

BTW, OCAP is a component that needs to be supported when implementing CableCard. That may be the real reason why Tivo has gone all the way to CableCard...

Why is DCC happening? Cable operators (aka MSOs) are being threatened by the PON-based services now being rolled out by TelCos (e.g. Verizon FiOS) and need to free-up unused "channels" on their systems to provide higher data rates to subscribers. But with must-carry requirements and the need to support Analog TVs, the MSOs find themselves in a bind. And DCC has shown that they can reclaim a good amount of digital channel capacity (up to 80%). Of course, another option is for MSOs to go "all Digital" -- but that requires the operators to provide settop boxes for every subscriber... at a significant cost...

If you're interested in more info on DCC, check out the white papers from BigBand:
http://www.bigbandnetworks.com/techn...paper_stat.php
http://www.bigbandnetworks.com/techn...er_statswb.php
http://www.bigbandnetworks.com/techn...per_evolve.php

Don't get me wrong -- I'd love to have support for Digital Cable (both SD and HD) in BTV. But there is a whole bunch more than just being able to "tune" the QAM channel/decode the MPEG-2 TS that SnapStream has to take into account for it to provide the same level of support we are used to for OTA Digital and Analog tuners...

[FunSavingATon]

Well, it looks like Comcast is expecting to do a big rollout of Switched Digital Video... Here's a report on Cable Digital News regarding their trials and amount of budget earmarked for it this year:
http://www.lightreading.com/document...22733&site=cdn

I'm wondering which channels are on the "Switched Tier"... Likely it isn't the locals, but it does make it harder to use a QAM tuner...

FunSavingATon