Multi tuner, multi lineup problem with padding

[Webbo]

A bit of a complex one so bear with me!

I am running two PVR-250s with an antenna (tuner) input plus an external cable box (composite) using the XMLTV Importer as follows:

PVR250 #1
Antenna

PVR250 #2
Antenna
Cable

The idea is that I can either record two shows from the antenna source or one from the antenna plus one from the cable. This works fine until I add 2 minutes padding to all recordings and record as follows:

Antenna (both shows on same channel):
Show1 20:00-21:00
Show2 21:00-22:00

Cable:
Show3 21:00-22:00

I can schedule all of this with no conflicts but when it come to the recordings, the following happens:

Show1: 19:58-21:02 (PVR250 #1)
Show2: 20:58-22:02 (PVR250 #2)
Show3: Not recorded

It appears that even though show1 and show2 are back to back, BTV still applies the padding to both shows as the source is available on both tuners and because of this misses the third show.

The behavior I would expect is for BTV to ignore the padding between Show1 and Show2 af if I had a single tuner system and record both of these on PVR250#1 which would leave PVR250#2 available to record show3.

Is there any way to change this behavior? The only solutions I have come up with are as follows and none of them are ideal:

1) Have one tuner dedicated to Antenna and one to Cable, but this prevents me from recording two simultaneous shows from the Antenna source which I would often like to do.
2) Get rid of padding but I am then likely to clip the end off shows.
3) Add a third tuner (expensive in terms of hardware and licenses).

Any help much appreciated!

[cpmiv]

I believe if you change the priority of the "3rd" show the 2nd tuner (the one with the cable box) should pick this up and then the 1st tuner should record the first show, stop, then record the second show. Look at the way BTV lists the recordings and you should be able to figure out which tuner will be active for each recording. Additionally you could change the order of your tuners. Changing the tuner order should help with this scenerio but may not for others.

I think that's the way it would work. Give it a shot.

[StephaneM]

Hello,

Originally Posted by Webbo

It appears that even though show1 and show2 are back to back, BTV still applies the padding to both shows as the source is available on both tuners and because of this misses the third show.

This is the correct behavior (at least for those who wants padding). With one tuner BTV dismiss the padding between back to back shows, but when you have more than one tuner, it well then respect your padding.

Though the case you described should have worked if you order you video inputs in Web Admin like this :

* PVR 250#2 - Cable
* PVR 250#2 - Antenna
* PVR 250#1 - Antenna

This way, show1 would have been recorded on PVR250#2, show2 on PVR250#1, then show3 on PVR250#2.

But the ideal order for your cards is:

* PVR 250#2 - Cable
* PVR 250#1 - Antenna
* PVR 250#2 - Antenna

So as to leave PVR250#2 free for Cable recordings.

Instead of changing constantly your tuner priorities, you can also record back to back job as if they were one (I do this constantly, there is an option in my Web guide to set up manual recordings based on EPG data and you can tell how much episode to record after the current one).

Regards,
Stéphane.

[Webbo]

Experimented with the following scemario in web admin:

* PVR 250#2 - Cable
* PVR 250#1 - Antenna
* PVR 250#2 - Antenna

Using two back to back "Antenna" shows plus one on "cable" due to start at the same time as the second "Antenna" show and still lost one of the shows.

I think it's time to either drop the antenna input from the second PVR250 or stop padding, both of which are less than ideal otherwise my Wife is going to schedule something that doesn't record and I'll be in trouble!

IMHO it would be better if BTV were intelligent enough to drop the padding rather than miss a show scheduled to record but I suspect that my configuration is unusual enough that this does not crop up very often!

Who would have thought the logic of having multiple tuners would be as complex as it is until you've really had a good think about it!

Ian.

[StephaneM]

Originally Posted by Webbo

Using two back to back "Antenna" shows plus one on "cable" due to start at the same time as the second "Antenna" show and still lost one of the shows.

Yes this is expected, the "ideal" order can't handle this situation (only 2 / 2 / 1 could).

I think it's time to either drop the antenna input from the second PVR250 or stop padding, both of which are less than ideal otherwise my Wife is going to schedule something that doesn't record and I'll be in trouble!

Don't let the wife touch the PVR . Seriously the more you record, the more conflicts you'll have. I think that BTV does its job pretty well. I have the exact same setup as yours (previously only one tuner) and to be able to record both antenna and satellite is a big plus.

The only thing you can do is plan to have your cable source on your both tuner. I'm also waiting to do this (I have found a Satellite Set Top Box with two tuners supporting two IR remote and two outputs, so it is easy for me). I would also wait to see what new hardware BTV will support

IMHO it would be better if BTV were intelligent enough to drop the padding rather than miss a show scheduled to record but I suspect that my configuration is unusual enough that this does not crop up very often!

Padding is a great thing (as well as extending the recording on both ends). Here in France shows on public network is rarely on time, padding is a great show saver.

The problem you face is common, and not only with back to back. However I don't think an algorithm could resolve padding problems such as this one. It's a matter of user preference (I do prefer a missed recording than an icomplete one), the better solution is : adding more tuners...

Meanwhile, you can still monitor what BTV will record or not and adjust your scheduled recording as necessary (the Web guide can send you an e-mail with all conflicts so it is easy to see if your wife has made a mistake behind your back).

Regards,
Stéphane.