Hauppauge HD PVR

[cat6man]

Not much happening in beta-land right now so I thought I would prematurely start this thread, so that when the Hauppauge HD-PVR is released later in 1Q08, the thread would be waiting.

As other threads have discussed (search on 'analog hole', or see Sage forum discussions, etc), this box will allow component (!!) capture of HD channels from cable and satellite boxes, our first non-vista-ocur method of accessing premium channels we are already paying for.

In my opinion, this is priority #1, #2 and #3 for the next beta.

To kick things off, I'd like to add one feature request:

Recordings should permit 'per recording' or 'per channel' setting of the recorded bit rate parameters.......unless i'm mistaken, we would want to record a 1080i channel in 1080i and a 720p channel in 720p.

Q: does that make sense, that picture quality would be better if the incoming resolution is maintained, or is this irrelevant since the coding to h.264 is not keeping the raw mgp data anyway?

thoughts?

p.s. i put the discussion here in the beta section for the inherently higher signal to noise ratio

[ZetaVu]

I am hoping there is a way to record non-hd channels at normal sd rates. My initial thought was to send the s-video out from the directv box to my pvr250, and the component out to this card, but then I remembered that it would use the same tuner and channels would change if there were programs in conflict. To do that (assuming there is not also an s-video input on this card) btv would have to assign both tuners as overlapping, meaning when one works the other treats it as a conflict. That would be a software fix still requiring two tuners.

Other option is to record everything through the component inputs, but question there is will btv see the incoming quality and adjust the recording to match? Also, can sd channels be saved as mpeg? Many questions to answer.

And the biggie, is there a coax in to record in 5.1, or are we back to converting all audio to 2 channel? That would be a major kick in the balls, and I'd be back ot considering the new Directv usb box, even if that meant (shudder) vista. Of course that all assumes it can work with btv or at the least Sage, vistamce is no different than getting a pvr from directv (and you probably pay a pvr fee with that box, so we're back to that issue again.

Honestly, if there is no 5.1 input on this card, I think we really need ot make an adjustment where audio can be captured with a coax or optical in on the computer, and a second audio file generated which can be synced up and played as an alternative sound for btv. But let's hope that Hauppauge is intelligent enough to realize that component video is useless with 2 channel sound.

[cat6man]

Originally Posted by ZetaVu

I am hoping there is a way to record non-hd channels at normal sd rates. My initial thought was to send the s-video out from the directv box to my pvr250, and the component out to this card, but then I remembered that it would use the same tuner and channels would change if there were programs in conflict. To do that (assuming there is not also an s-video input on this card) btv would have to assign both tuners as overlapping, meaning when one works the other treats it as a conflict. That would be a software fix still requiring two tuners.

Other option is to record everything through the component inputs, but question there is will btv see the incoming quality and adjust the recording to match? Also, can sd channels be saved as mpeg? Many questions to answer.

And the biggie, is there a coax in to record in 5.1, or are we back to converting all audio to 2 channel? That would be a major kick in the balls, and I'd be back ot considering the new Directv usb box, even if that meant (shudder) vista. Of course that all assumes it can work with btv or at the least Sage, vistamce is no different than getting a pvr from directv (and you probably pay a pvr fee with that box, so we're back to that issue again.

Honestly, if there is no 5.1 input on this card, I think we really need ot make an adjustment where audio can be captured with a coax or optical in on the computer, and a second audio file generated which can be synced up and played as an alternative sound for btv. But let's hope that Hauppauge is intelligent enough to realize that component video is useless with 2 channel sound.

from what i've read, 5.1 is no problem.....spdif i believe, so your main concern should be OK

inputs include svideo and/or component, so you're ok there as well

lastly, i'm pretty sure you'll be able to pick a lower bit rate for h.264 encoding of SD......will it be automatic in the hauppauge box, highly unlikely, which is why i suggest above a 'per channel' or 'per recording' setting in BTV to allow us to tailor the recording to the resolution of the channel

mpg out....nope....only h.264 and AVC (bluray).....h.264 container unknown at this time (hopefully mkv but who knows)

[ZetaVu]

Thanks, any links with that info?

[geoffstewart]

ZetaVu,

Aren't you really talking about making multiple channel lineups? One that has the SD channels enabled and HD hidden and it's attached to the PVR-250. And the second lineup has the SD channels hidden and the HD channels enabled would be attached to the HD-PVR?

Maybe I missed your point about conflict.

Geoff

[danziko]

When will this be out and what card will I need? I am new to Beyond TV. Thanks!

[Bigbird999]

dan
They claim Q1 this year, but so far it is vaporware. I don't think anybody has even seen one unless you count the one in a black box behind the curtain at the CES. Everybody wants one.

BB

[Rich A]

Originally Posted by Bigbird999

dan
They claim Q1 this year, but so far it is vaporware. I don't think anybody has even seen one unless you count the one in a black box behind the curtain at the CES. Everybody wants one.

BB

And to add to that, that card WILL BE the one you want. Compare it to an old analog Hauppauge tuner that has inputs for an RF tuner and S-video. Instead this will not have a tuner and only have component and S-Video input.

This is sort of the "holy grail" of PC type PVRs. That is because the best quality input currently available to us is one of the existing cards that has S-Video input. If this card does ever come to be, it will have component input which is capable of MUCH higher resolution.

The higher the resolution being fed to the card that is doing the encoding, the better looking the final result will be.

The one question in mind (as was mentioned earlier in this topic) is how good will the cards final encoded video be? What is going to happen is that you will be feeding this card an excellent component video, and the card will be encoding that to some type of mp4. There are lots of mp4 "type" videos using the h.264 compression scheme. So it remains to be seen how it will look and play in Beyond TV.

I have a "good" feeling about this. After all BTV is already set up with its own h264 encoder which can be used optionally as one of the showsqueeze formats ... Soooo the base playback capability is already there.

I have already tried a few videos that were encoded using the h264 scheme. And BTV can play them back nicely.

[cat6man]

i would assume that the gamut of h.264 encoding levels is supported......if is wasn't, it wouldn't be very HD..........i also have a good feeling about this

[ZetaVu]

Originally Posted by geoffstewart

ZetaVu,

Aren't you really talking about making multiple channel lineups? One that has the SD channels enabled and HD hidden and it's attached to the PVR-250. And the second lineup has the SD channels hidden and the HD channels enabled would be attached to the HD-PVR?

Maybe I missed your point about conflict.

Geoff

That is exactly what I am talking about, I do this for analog OTA channels with my coax and satellite channels with s-video on my pvr-250, I hide the analog from s-video, so btv will not try to record anything with the s-video if it is recording something with the coax. However, in this case, half the channels are on one tuner and half on another, so if a show is being recorded on s-video on the pvr-250 btv might try to record a show on the HD-PVR at the same time, different tuners, split source. BTV would have to have a way to assign that both tuners use the same source. Otherwise, I can record one setting on s-video and another on component using the HD-PVR, but both would be recorded in H.264, albeit it different recording rates. The card may also intelligently adjust file size per input signal so this may not be necessary. I would have liked to get sd shows s-video in mpeg format, but I probably would be better off not having to commit 2 tuners to this.

[geoffstewart]

Originally Posted by ZetaVu

... However, in this case, half the channels are on one tuner and half on another, so if a show is being recorded on s-video on the pvr-250 btv might try to record a show on the HD-PVR at the same time, different tuners, split source. ...

I must need coffee, but I'm still trying to understand what's missing.

So, you have the s-video from the satellite box connected to the pvr250 and the component connection from the *same* satellite box connected to the HDPVR, right?

And you're worried about both the pvr250 and the HDPVR recording the same show at the same time? Wouldn't prioritizing the video sources and the fact that it's the same show make BTV just record one instance of it?

Or am I still way off?

Geoff

[ZetaVu]

Say sd channel 200 has a show I want to record and HD channel 300 has a different show I want to record at the same time, so both tuners might try to record both shows simultaneously. If it were done on the same tuner, only one show would be allowed to record, but with two tuners, we need a way to say we are using the same source, otherwise one show gets recorded on both tuners (only one show can be tuned at a time, whichever is second in priority)

[geoffstewart]

duh! I get it now... thanks for your patience.

[cat6man]

i wonder if BTV-Externinator and Fonceur might be able to do this and prevent the conflict?

why don't you give him a message and see what he thinks.......his stuff if pretty flexible

[Bigbird999]

I'm excited about this box too, and really want one, but you guys are way out in front of me. You are writing plugins and troubleshooting lineup conflicts for an as yet unseen product. Like I tell my very enthusiastic and somewhat impulsive son, it is Ready! Aim! Fire!, not READY! FIRE! AIM!!

BB